25 Nov 2018 16:34:15
Thing that stands out this season is that our form drops after international breaks. This could simply be the result of tired players, but it seems more like frustration at coming back to the club set up.

Take Rashford and Lingard, for example, they're playing in an attacking national side in important roles, and do well. Then, they're back here, with 10 men behind the ball, and they're crap. In contrast, Spurs's English player carry their international form into the next game, and in Ali's case step up to try to win their place back. For me, it's a clear case of our player's preferring playing in the international setups, and that's down to Jose, particularly with his unnecessary comments this week.

I doubt we will finish top four this season, so Jose is done. The question is do we rush into an appointment mid-term, put someone temporary in place, or keep Jose until May to give us more time to bring in the right replacement?

1.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 17:39:38
Get rid asap, we need to just right this season off and allow someone new to get a feel of what he needs i the summer, rather than continuing this circus of employing someone to spend a year dealing with the failings of the previous manger. Maybe if we get rid of Jose we maybe able to convince our better want away players from leaving and fingers crossed stop the club giving players like young valencia jones and smalling new contracts.

2.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 17:42:05
All depends on the appointment of a dof.
If one is put in place soon then will jose work them? Will he want to work with who ever it is and will the new dof want Jose.
I was all for Jose to sort it out but after yesterday I don't see how he can turn things around without selling a lot and bringing in alot.
I think he will see out the season then will be on his way hopefully by then the people who need to will have a plan in place and we can start to carry that out.

3.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 17:44:28
I’d sack him let carrick have till end of season give players a lift bring some confidence back anything is better than this .

4.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 18:05:11
A DOF is designed to be an intermediary between the manager and owners, they do nothing to help the relationship between Jose and the players. A DOF is essential for long term transfer planning, but the more immediate issue is the players aren’t performing for Jose, and we’re slipping further and further away from competing for trophies.

5.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 18:44:14
Its a tough one. My heart says sack him asap. But my head isn't so sure.

On one hand it clearly isn't going to get better with Jose, he is on the downward trajectory with our club like he seems to get into at every club in his third season. So it seems like a case of when not if to sack Jose.

If we sack him now, what happens next? Well we either appoint a permanent manager or a temporary manager until the end of the season. The problem here is the club are actively looking for a DoF, and it makes more sense if the next permanent appointment is made by the DoF, who will have to work closely with the new manager. So maybe appointing a temporary manager is best. Then you have to decide does that come from in house or outside? In house knows the players and the situation so maybe best placed to solve those issues (although they could also be part of the problem) . However, what happens when the next permanent appointment is made is the temporary manager happy to go back to his old role, or even a different role within the club. We saw how Giggs wasn't happy to stay after Mourinho's appointment. We could lose an excellent coach or potential future manager in McKenna or Carrick if they are given temporary charge then asked to step back into old roles or similar lesser roles.

So there are serious concerns with who you replace Jose with both short term and long term, and that doesn't even take into consideration about who is making these appointments and their less than stella past record of managerial appointments.

So do we stick with Jose and give us some time to find a DoF, then at the end of the season let him go and let the new DoF make his appointment. I would expect that there are clauses in any severance pay tied in to UCL qualification, so the club could save some money if we finish 5th or lower when removing the manager. We have seen with the last two sackings that failure to get UCL qualification was the key moment in deciding their fate, or at least so it seemed. This may seem like the better plan.

However, we may lose some key players if they aren't happy with Jose and the club stick with him until the end of the season. Also is not qualifying for the UCL a good plan? Also how long will it take to appoint a DoF, if an appointment is forth coming then it could be months. Or even into next season before we fill the role. Can we wait off that long? Also would a new DoF be happy with having to recruit a new manager as their first task in taking the role. Surely they will want to spend some time adjust to the club and understanding the dynamics and the people they will have to work with. Give them a chance of hiring a man who they can work with and who fits in with the club and what the club needs.

Which might mean it could be better to severe ties with Jose sooner and get in someone on a temporary basis. Giving us the best chance of UCL qualification, giving the club breathing space to hire the right DoF, and giving that DoF a chance to understand the club before they make a permanent appointment.

So the decision probably should be do we go with a McKenna/ Carrick combo or do we bring someone in from outside the club? Either option there is a risk that Carrick/ McKenna could feel slighted and eventually leave.

6.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 19:01:45
Carrick and McKenna are part of why we are playing so poorly? Why promote them?

7.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 20:48:05
Shappy

We need stability until there is DOF

However, if we make a change, we should offer Wenger a chance until the end of the season. Sorry if that isn’t popular but we must have time to plan.

8.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 21:08:15
To plan for what? His 35 consecutive season without a title?

Wenger is another spent force. You’d think after van Gaal, and now Jose, we’d stop trying to resuscitate yesterday’s men.

9.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 21:28:16
So if we just sign a DOF everythi g will be ok?

People said once over all we needed was a Cm bought 3
We needed a cb, bought 2
We needed a creative player bought 2 .
But if we just get a DOF he will fix everything and 100% do a good job.

{Ed025's Note - i dont think a DOF would be an option at this stage jred, it has to be 2 people who can work together as a team and i dont see jose taking kindly to someone telling him who and when he can buy as hes just not that type of guy, he likes full control thats just the way he works, maybe january will tell us where the club is heading mate..

10.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 21:33:55
What about our current situation screams stability to you? We have a fan base divided, a squad of players where half want to leave, and general discord running throughout the club. The media is having a field day taking daily shots at us. We appear to be on a clear downward trajectory. Just to put it into perspective we are having a worst season than Moyes had.

I wouldn't be against Wenger on a short term deal. He knows the league, plays good football and wouldn't be the worst short term solution.

Plus it would be a real poke in the eye for Mourinho. lol.

11.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 22:19:27
People seem to want to compare Moyes season to this one, Get real, We were the previous season champions and I remember some of those now moaning about Mourinho were ones telling me that because we won the league by 11 points it was too much for any other team to make up so Moyes could not fail.
It is where you end the season that matters.

12.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 22:46:51
Ed
I agree.
Redman
I remember you saying you wanted moyes sacked before a ball was kicked and that you wouldn't back .
Yet you get upset if people question our current manager .

Do you not mean people should back Redman opinion?

13.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 22:56:53
By the way I think fergys biggest achievement was winning the title with that team .

I think we have better players now than cleverly and co but fergy won it by 11 points.

14.) 25 Nov 2018
25 Nov 2018 23:35:13
People talk about Sir Alex winning his final league title and Moyes inheriting that side as if Moyes had an easier time than Jose.

Let's get this straight, Jose took his own title winning side at Chelsea to the point of being in the relegation zone in December the following season.

So let's not suggest success last season means success this season.

Also as many have pointed out, sir Alex's last title winning squad was probably the weakest winning squad in our history. I remember better United sides finishing second on more than one occasion.

15.) 26 Nov 2018
26 Nov 2018 06:50:50
Jred

I was very clear about Moyes, not before a ball was kicked, as you keep peddling, but when there was a rumour before he was even announced.

I don’t get upset as you put it when people question our manager, given performances that is understandable. However that isn’t what is happening, nearly every post, every comment is sack him, yet we have no direction as a club, so it would mean another Woodward appointment and off we go again. There will be 5 managers players in the team and the problems permeating the club plus attitude of players will still be there. No one can be happy right now but I feel the answer is not always sack the manager. Maybe many years of being a manager plus a stint as a football one, even brief and low level, gives me some empathy towards Mourinho who is getting pelted from everywhere. He has the cv unlike Moyes and therefore having lived through the post Busby years, want to give him as much chance as reasonable. That is not upset but I have as much right to defend the manager as you do to criticise him.

16.) 26 Nov 2018
26 Nov 2018 09:06:54
Redman
Stop with the silly posts, I'm managing now . So what
It gives you some empathy towards Jose but you wanted moyes sacked before a ball was kicked .
It double standard after double standard .
Take a step back and listen to yourself.

17.) 26 Nov 2018
26 Nov 2018 09:50:06
Red Man, how can your experience give you empathy for one manager and not another?

In my mind I have more empathy for a manager who was thrown in at the deep end without the relative experience then slated for not being able to do a job he clearly never had the ability to do. Than a manager who has the experience but through his own bloody mindedness has the team performing poorly because of his refusal to adapt to the situation.

18.) 26 Nov 2018
26 Nov 2018 10:58:06
It's going round in circles, I find it hard to lay the blame for moyes and lvg term in charge at there feet then excuses Jose and lay the blame with woods or the board or no DOF which I think is being massively overplayed .
I'm not sure many on here actually understand what a DOF does or who is currently making the decisions a DOF if appointed would .
Maybe if we had pep or poch and the team was playing well people wouldn't be talking about lack of investment lack of ambition . After all we have one of the highest transfer spends in world football over the last few year . Have the 3rd largest wage bill in world football the highest in EPL.

Maybe people are right and the club is that badly run and lack so much ambition that it is impossible for any manager to do well at the club .
We should accept that players like Fred pogba matic Shaw ddg martial lukaku rash linders Mata are just average players incapable of playing attractive football or to any standard .

19.) 26 Nov 2018
26 Nov 2018 18:14:57
Shappy

I had sympathy for Moyes because he was appointed when very clearly he was not remotely qualified for the job and his cv told us that. It was utterly obvious before the appointment, so part of me had sympathy for someone who was so clearly going to fail. I have empathy for Mourinho and his cv does have the requisite skills and medals.

Jred
Maybe you haven’t had to work at a strategic level, so whilst I have not been a DOF, I believe I might have a good guess at one does.

Players get away with poor performances, they are responsible for poor performances, the manager is accountable. I would show some the door in January, make an example, because if they win and the manager goes before some of them, we will only be putting the problems back a few months.

20.) 26 Nov 2018
26 Nov 2018 21:10:28
Redman
Maybe I have?
You may belive you know . That doesn't really mean you do .

It doesn't sound one bit like you do tho .
What you would do means very little to be honest .