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shawthing's rumours posts with other poster's replies to shawthing's rumours posts


13 Jan 2018 13:49:56
Sanchez has a bit of the Tevez about him. Very emotional. He obviously has all the skills, and when he's motivated his intensity and purpose adds a dimension to his game that any team would covet. So what is it that motivates him.

Clearly it's the thought of winning honours, and conversely looking at he seems to be demotivated by his team's mediocrity. So my guess is that:

1) he would only come to United if he thought he would win the EPL and/ or the Champions League in the next couple of years, and

2) if he did come, and it looked like those objectives were not going to be fulfilled, then it would be a disastrous transfer because his negative emotionality would end up leeching into and upsetting the dressing room.

Like for most supporters winning is ultimately more important than style. Arsenal play with style but they don't win the important trophies any more, which doesn't please their supporters and is clearly a demotivation to top players.


1.) 13 Jan 2018 15:39:18
Agreed for sure!

Lucas Moura maybe?

On another note, I mentioned a defender Jorge Mere who was at Espanyol and now at Koln and NOW Barça are after him!

We should have got this guy! Well disappointed!

2.) 13 Jan 2018 16:06:08
Well Ronnie don't mean to be rude but you might have named atleast 200 players by now. It might be difficult for United hierarchy to properly understand which one you want.

3.) 13 Jan 2018 16:34:44
I deserved that! 😂.

4.) 13 Jan 2018 21:09:56
For Sanchez's supposed attitude you can see the same thing happening at Spurs in the next 18 months if they win nothing -Ali, Erikson etc have no real affinity to Spurs as many players don't to their clubs. Sanchez probably looks around and sees nothing there but the odd FA CUp. maybe views us the same . time will tell.



05 Apr 2017 14:41:52
Two woodworks and a good goal disallowed epitomise what has been a most frustrating season. It's giving me ulcers. Virtually every game we've played we have created enough good chances to win the game handily. It's not down to tactics, it's down to finishing. The team in general seems to be suffering from a collective psychological block and somehow or other that problem has to be overcome.

The weight of expectation for players like Shaw, Pogba, Rashford, Martial, and Mhki needs to be lifted so that they are loose enough to begin to play to their potential. At present I'm sure the burden is as unbearable for the players as it is the fans.


1.) 05 Apr 2017 14:57:00
If you hit the post you have missed the target, its not bad luck it's a miss.

2.) 05 Apr 2017 15:11:46
It started since we stopped Dabbing and doing crazy handshakes for winning throw ins and corners! We need to bring them back.

3.) 05 Apr 2017 15:39:39
We've had the third most shots in the league.

No team in Europe have hit the bar/ post more than us. In fact we've hit it 9 more times than any other team.

5 of the 7 goalkeepers to win man of the match in the EPL this season have done so against us.

No team in the EPL has had more shot saved than us.

No team in the EPL has had more shots blocked than us.

It's starting to feel like a voodoo or gypsy curse. Surely we can't continue to be this unlucky.

4.) 05 Apr 2017 15:53:05
It's not bad luck though shappy.

5.) 05 Apr 2017 16:08:40
Strange how top sports men don't have bad luck .
It's all excesses and a bit embarrassing.
"There other gk had a good game "

Ddg been our best player the last 4 year . Luck or poor finishing?

6.) 05 Apr 2017 16:23:36
If it's not luck then what is it?

As for DDG making many saves, he does it every week, that's what makes him world class. Many of the keepers who have won motm against us this season have done so with their best performance in several years. They aren't world class keepers, they just have a strangely world class performance against us. Robles last night had a very good game, yet was awful a couple of days before against Liverpool.

The running joke this season is who is the best keeper in the world? Whoever's​ playing against United this week.

If you were Jose what would you be doing differently to make these chances into goals?

7.) 05 Apr 2017 16:36:20
I'm not Jose that's why he gets paid the big bucks .
Martial Rasford Ibra miki pogba mata I could go on have shown they are good players, have shown they can put the ball in net .

Chelsea where awful last season, poor at the start of the season, conte worked it out tho, and Chelsea and conte haven't been lucky in the same way United haven't been unlucky .
Over a season it works itself out .

Gk are there to make saves, defenders are there to defend you can't complain when the other team play well it sounds pathetic .

8.) 05 Apr 2017 16:37:57
By the way never mind chances, United have been poor the last couple of month as a team.

9.) 05 Apr 2017 16:41:18
Should also say getting the best out of your players is a very if not the most important job of the manager.

10.) 05 Apr 2017 16:42:58
Well put Shappy.

11.) 05 Apr 2017 20:06:38
I'd stop whining and slagging off my players. Just saying.

12.) 06 Apr 2017 21:11:02
I was trying to be sarcastic shaps! Guess I should put that in brackets lol.

We have been unlucky in many ways but we should also be doing better regardless of 'bad luck'

13.) 08 Apr 2017 09:15:02
Chipping in on the lucky/ unlucky theme.

If you're good enough you make your own luck surely?

What the stats suggest, in my opinion, is that we keep possession and stay compact. But we don't take risks often or quickly enough. And that's reflected in how we play.

Some of that is legacy of the last few years, some is the players and some is the manager.

I'm not a Jose fan, but i do believe he has to be given the time to implement his style. Personally i think if the goals and performances aren't showing through next season then he isn't going to achieve it.



30 Nov 2016 18:23:29
I cannot see us changing the manager under virtually any circumstances other than a complete capitulation. Without that Jose will be given the year. If we win the Europa and finish 8th in the league we will be in the Champions League. (I think we will finish 5th or 6th) . If we were to fire him then finding a new manager will be difficult except, of course, that failure = a big pay off when the contract is cancelled which may be something of a consolation.

A lot of the criticism is unfounded. The team has been playing quite well, just not getting the results. This brings us to Ibra. We all knew from the beginning that his role was a short term stop gap for a year or two while Martial and Rashford mature.

The last 3 years have been pretty dire by our standards, but at least this year the team is playing with attacking intent. Be grateful. At least that's the first of the complaints about LVG satisfied. In my view the anxiety of the fans is feeding into the players, so relax folks. Support the team and the manager and have hope.


1.) 30 Nov 2016 21:59:30
He is staying. Keep this simple.



29 Nov 2015 23:27:16
Another week goes by and the top teams struggle to win. City's scoreline flattered them, with their goals coming as much from errors by Southampton. It really has become a difficult league and our point at Leicester was not bad, all things considered. If Arsenal have Sanchez injured for a while their challenge may well falter, giving Liverpool and Spurs an opening. We have an opportunity to take advantage of what should be some winnable games and go into the new year on top. Will we take it?





shawthing's banter posts with other poster's replies to shawthing's banter posts


08 Jan 2018 14:24:15
I was just reading the Manchester Evening News. It gave a list of SAF's signings subsequent to the 2008 Champions League triumph:

Dimitar Berbatov, Antonio Valencia, Michael Owen, Gabriel Obertan, Mame Biram Diouf, Chris Smalling, Javier Hernandez, Bebe, David de Gea, Phil Jones, Ashley Young, Shinji Kagawa, Nick Powell, Robin van Persie, Angelo Henriquez, Alexander Buttner and Wilfried Zaha.

Other than de Gea, was there one world class star who one might have envisaged having a long illustrious career at United? Compound that with his disastrous choice of Moyes as his successor, whose inappropriateness led to LVG, and these two manager's inept signings and you have where we are.

Whether his poor transfer record during the latter stages of his career was as a result of his own parsimony, his inability to adapt to a more modernist and international style coaching techniques, an unwillingness to be taken advantage of by agents, financial strictures courtesy of the Glazer's LBO debt, or just sheer arrogance, or a combination of all of five is a matter for conjecture, but an honest assessment of his illustrious career requires that it should not be swept under the
rug. As a man paid to speak about business and motivation at places like Harvard Business School, isn't it the case that the final lesson of his career is that without the right combination of recruitment of young talent, letting go of the old before its past sell by date, and the adoption of new advanced techniques, any business will become moribund, stale and die.


1.) 08 Jan 2018 15:00:07
He won 3 more league titles after 08, he also took us to 2 CL finals which we lost to arguably the greatest club side this side of the war.
What point are you trying to make with this? Some of them did turn out to be duds but you can’t deny the mans legacy at the club because he had a few transfer flops.

2.) 08 Jan 2018 15:32:06
Good post Shaw but Fergi somehow managed to keep pulling rabbits out of hats which papered over the cracks.

With the strength of the premier league and the emergence of teams such as Spurs and L'pool performing on a more consistent basis without significant investment even Fergi would have struggled to compete. I guess we'll never know if the lack of investment during his formative years was due to constrictions placed upon him by the Glazer regime or his unwillingness to pay big transfer fees, agents and wages etc.

I always judged Fergi by how well we competed in Europe and after two drubbings by Barcelona in 2009 and 2011 he certainly didn't do enough to keep us at that level. Those defeats should have been a kick up the back side and we should have witnessed significant investment sadly this never happened or was ever likely to happen given most of the names on your list.

3.) 08 Jan 2018 16:49:48
Shawthing, what is your point? When you consider some of the players we already had during that time it becomes clear that maybe we didn’t need a overhaul between 2008-2011/ 2. We had VVD, Neville, Ferdinand, Vidic, Evra, Carrick, Hargreaves, Scholes, Nani, Rooney, Ronaldo and Tevez. Admittedly Ronaldo left in 2009 and to be honest there was no player bar maybe Messi who we could have signed to replace him. We bought players such as Smalling, Jones. DDG and Powell who were supposed to be ones for the future, sadly atm only DDG has worked out as hoped. The other three have had issues staying fit. Zaha was supposed to be another in that category but that didn’t work out either. Valencia, Young, Berbatov, Kagawa and van Persie were all top players either in our league or in Germany when we signed them, they were at good ages and have had varying levels of success. The rest were squad fillers (Obertan, Buttner or Diouf) or calculated risks such as Owen, Hernandez or Bebe. Most didn’t work out but considering we signed all those players for less than 20m if one or or two did, great, if not then we should be able to recoup at least what we paid for them.
Sadly most of those signings failed to hit the heights and in hindsight we might have been better of signing half as many but investing more in higher quality players. But that's the advantage of hindsight.
I think towards the end of Sir Alex’s reign everyone knew he would be leaving either this year or within the next couple, with that in mind I can understand why the club might have been reluctant to spend big on a player who might not be wanted by the next manager. Subsequently we have had three new managers and each of them have signed a club record signing during their time (Mata, Di Maria and Pogba), which I think backs up the idea that the club didn’t want to spend big during Sir Alex’s final couple of seasons.

Maybe the club should have approached him before and ushered him out the door earlier if keeping him in the job was restrictive to the growth of the club. However if they had done that after all Sir Alex had done for the club the supporters would have been up in arms. You need to show respect to a manager who has given so much to the club, surely he had earned the right to go out on his terms? Sadly that meant the club maybe couldn’t or at least was reluctant to invest heavily in a team being built by someone who would soon depart.

4.) 08 Jan 2018 17:19:36
*VDS obviously. lol.

5.) 08 Jan 2018 18:06:52
Just about to post something similar . But shorter.

6.) 08 Jan 2018 18:19:31
SAF was clearly a great, probably the greatest manager, of all time as far as British football is concerned. His record speaks for itself. His ability to get the most out of his resources is beyond dispute. What he accomplished at Aberdeen was amazing, and how he managed to win that 20th championship was perhaps the greatest achievement of all. Nothing can ever take any of that away and United fans should be for ever grateful for him, and honour him accordingly. But let's not make him a God. Even the greats have their weaknesses, and, in my opinion, SAF's weakness was that he was ultimately unable to adapt to the transition from a league that was essentially populated by players of British descent to a truly international one. Danny Lancs mentions the two drubbings by Barcelona and the reaction, or lack of it. That sums it up to me. Whatever the reason for the lack of response is up to conjecture, however one of the possibilities to be considered is that Ferguson didn't have the tactical ability to contend with that level of performance.

Shappy, as for the lack of need to invest because of the quality of the existing players, I can't agree. The fact is that the squad was getting older and each player that went past his best was never replaced with equal quality. One of the greatest of all management skills is to recognize when a player has passed their prime within the context of the growth and reinvention of the team. Clough and Taylor were excellent at this, and SAF himself showed himself adept when he sold Beckham and Van Nistelrooy. But that process stopped, and instead he began to rely more and more on an aging core of players, bequeathing to his successor a poisoned chalice. Giggs, Scholes, Keane, Ronaldo, Tevez etc were never replaced adequately. I think he knew exactly what was going to happen but he was not prepared to see his own reputation suffer by adopting the one principle he had previously lived by: giving youth a chance.

7.) 08 Jan 2018 18:31:02
Good post shappy.
The squad he left behind was full of aging players rvp Rio vidic evra carrick Rooney fletch giggs the squad was filled out with some mentioned above and some remain today in young Jones smalling carrick ddg valencia.

8.) 08 Jan 2018 20:06:15

Some excellent points

One of the strong attributes of SAF was that he built great teams and then rebuilt them. After Ronaldo left in 2009 you could see the start of the decline. Yes, he was impossible to replace, yet we made almost no effort to do so. When our team cried out for investment SAF brought Scholes out of retirement. SAF watched his great players age, Rio, Giggs, Neville and Scholes yet when players like Aguero and Hazard became available there was no value in the market. We can argue the cause, for me part Glazernomics and part SAF getting to the point where he didn’t feel able to build another team and didn’t want to be the one to make more tough decisions.

However, did he really earn the right to go out on his own terms? Are people really saying SAF was bigger than the club, more important than the continuity of the club’s success? Adulation is one thing but he was ultimately an employee of the club and should have been worked with to ensure succession went smoothly, the lack of that transition brought major problems. No matter how much we love SAF for all he did, he should have had the same respect as other employees of the club, great players, but the club should come first, it’s success and continuity. By not doing that we only show there is too much emotion in decision making.

9.) 08 Jan 2018 20:09:08
Shappy - I think Shaw makes a fair point to be honest mate. That list makes pretty grim reading and the Ronaldo money was never really invested back into the Club. A lot of those players you've mentioned E VDS, Evra, Neville, Rio, Giggs, Scholes etc were nearing the end of their careers, the likes of Smalling and Jones were brought into replace them but didn't have the same quality and more importantly couldn't stay fit, Hargreaves was never fit and don't forget we lost Tevez the same year as Ronaldo.

Fergi was getting the best out of what he had and doing an amazing job with some ageing stars, home grown players and squad fillers. I think what Shaw meant was that when he retired he left a squad bereft of any real quality and ageing stars perhaps now past their best. There can be no argument that during that time there was a significant lack of investment in the squad and surely you spend whilst at the top.

I wonder how much money City spent in that same period? They've not stopped and are still outspending us today.

We rested on our laurels and didn't invest to try and allow us to compete with the likes of Barca! I can't believe for one minute that Fergi wasn't hurting following those defeats and didn't want to try and improve the squad. From memory we had relatively straightforward draws into both finals and maybe our team wasn't quite as good as we thought it was!

In my opinion we didn't adequately replace Ronaldo or Tevez and the investment in the squad from that summer until Fergi retired simply wasn't there!

We didn't appoint the right man to succeed Fergi and to compound matters we didn't back him in the transfer market either our only signing being Fellaini in a panic induced deadline day disaster!

Is it any wonder we have struggled so much in the last few years!

10.) 08 Jan 2018 21:01:04
Very interesting topic and opinions guys.

When we won the league and champions league double in 2008 we were not only the best team in England but the best in Europe in my opinion; a balance of pace, movement, flair, solidity and leadership that was unmatched in my view. But for certain reasons we allowed ourselves to decline, initially to a team that was still in for the big titles but started to play some uninspiring football, eventually to one that often plays uninspiring football and isn't truly in for the two biggest titles, as it is now. A combination of glazernomics and latter-day Fergie at his stubborn worst started this off in my opinion.

Still goes down as the greatest football manager in history for me and a man I would love to meet one day.

11.) 08 Jan 2018 21:26:35
It's nearly 5 year since fergy left that's a huge amount of time in a players career.
We are going back 5 transfer windows 10 including January windows .
We have bought 23 first team players in that time plus rash kean lingard foush etc come through .
Ronaldo and tevez left nearly 9 year ago . Tevez because he struggled for a game after we blew 30 mil on Berb.

Living a wee bit in the past here.

12.) 08 Jan 2018 21:43:08

5 years.
Giggs played for 24 years for the club
Rio, 12 years
Gary Neville, 19 years
Scholes, 20 years

Is 5 years a “huge” amount of time?

The point is that these were key players we let retire around the same time and did not replace satisfactorily. The king is dead, long live the king, except at United where we wallow in emotion and ignore Glazernomics.

13.) 08 Jan 2018 21:52:36
Can't argue with any of that Rave!

For those bemoaning Jose pragmatism just remember that it was Fergi that left Tevez, Berba and Scholes on the bench in a Champions League final against a team that had Ya Ya Toure at CB.

After that humbling defeat we lost Ronaldo and Tevez and didn't replace them. We didn't make another significant signing until we got RVP. Looking back it amazes me how we wasn't all up in arms and yet we still reached another Champs League final! I still can't decide if we didn't spend because of constraints on the Club from the Glazers or Fergi's insistence there was no value in the market! Red Man quite rightly points out Hazard and Aguero make a mockery of that statement. I don't think we'll ever really know.

This isn't an anti Fergi post the man was a genius and the way he built team after team was remarkable I'm just saying that I think there was a real lack of investment in the team from 2009 onwards hence the position we find ourselves in today.

Jred - We have to look into our past to understand our future.

14.) 08 Jan 2018 22:11:32
It shows how difficult out is to get the right player at the right time and to have the coach and system to get the best out of any new signing. Also how difficult it is to assess if a player will settle or be overawed or if he is only coming for the money.
As jred has said 23 players in. Very few if any bad players. But you ciuld argue that very few have come in from those 23 that have truly excelled and won our hearts with their play. None jump out as real leaders.
Some of the 23 flopped completely for loads of reasons morgan Bastian falcao di maria varela (ibra This season) depay miki.
Some have come in and done ok at times but not commanded a regular start for again many reasons I would include blind fellaini Romero darmian none appear to have a long term future with the club any longer.

Then there is a group in that 23 that have played very well at times and make a consistent positive contribution but there are doubts I wiuld suggest on their futures with the club for again many reasons mata shaw rojo herrera fall into this category imo. But all could easily be kept. The ball is in their court.

Then imo there is a final group from the 23 players signed that look like they will be the corner stone of the squad cooing forward bailly lindelof matic pogba martial lukaku plus academy graduates rash jessie mctominay tuanzabe tfm gomes. A few experienced heads like ddg young valencia jones or smalling and mata and shaw along with 5 or 6 new signings would be ideal.
So i would expect out of the 23 players signed to date that a maximum of 8 of those will be in the squad in 2 windows time and 5 of those 8 will have been signed by jose.

15.) 08 Jan 2018 22:23:58
Jred, I'm living in the now, which enables me to respond to you without a Tardis.

Yes, we're in the 5th year since Fergie resigned, but the first three were under the stewardship of Moyes, his hand picked successor, and then LVG, the replacement of desperation. Ferguson's shadow is only now starting to recede.

The point of this analysis was to give a realistic perspective on the problems Mourinho has had to encounter as the manager of United. Clearly some of the difficulties have had nothing to do with SAF and are as a result of the club structure itself.

Suffice it to say, for whatever reason you care to come up with, as far as football is concerned, City have taken over the Manchester mantle. The way things are going it will not be too long before they catch up with us as far as revenues are concerned too. Their business plan is well thought out and executed, while providing great entertainment value I watched some of their goals against Burnley in the cup. Gundogan, another player linked with us for years, was fantastic. Silva is always brilliant. Rio himself, a United man through and through, recently said they're the best team on the planet.

16.) 08 Jan 2018 22:24:53
Ken I really like your last sentence! I think Jose's signings have been really good. Ok maybe Miki hasn't quite worked and Lindelof has had a tough start but in general he's bought well. I think given the right backing he'll put a really strong team together over the next few windows. History will tell us he doesn't last longer than 3 years at any Club so hopefully we'll see him buck this trend. If not he'll leave the Club in a much better position than he found it with players such as Bailly, Pogba and Lukaku forming the spine for the next manger.

17.) 08 Jan 2018 22:52:31
Danny maybe taking over a team that came a disappointing 5th when he took over which was level points with city, then spending 300 million in two year on 7 internationals and saying he will leave us better than he found us isn't the Everest of achievements in football management.

18.) 09 Jan 2018 00:31:34
Considering he won 2 trophies last season and we sit 2nd in the table, he’s not done too bad.

Back José ooossh.



05 Jan 2018 22:14:56
Another incredible strike and with virtually no backlift. Jesse Lingard must be worth £100m by now!


1.) 05 Jan 2018 22:23:55
Was put in the not United class bracket for a good while .
Looking a good player at the moment.

2.) 05 Jan 2018 22:24:19
Great strike again by him shaw. He keeps proving people etting. Playing with confidence.
We made hard work of it tonight but thoroughly deserved to win.
Lovely second goal too.
Miki in contrast to jessie looks like a guy who has forgotten how to play he is struggling to do the basics.
We are in the hat let's hope for a home draw and see where it takes us.

3.) 05 Jan 2018 22:46:04
Hes been playing really well and has become more consistent in from of goal. He deserves a pat on the back. Hopefully he continues to score lots more for the club.

4.) 05 Jan 2018 22:51:19
I'm not ashamed to admit that I thought Lingard would never be good enough for United. I was wrong. Now, there is one thing that still infuriates me. The kid scores cracking goals, long range bombs and mazy runs, he's got a top 10 goals that can rival almost anyone. But he still fluffs far too many easy chances, tap-ins, etc. If he can score the simple ones and continue to add the occasional special goal, then that's when he'll truly be worthy of a long term role in the starting xi. For now I'll continue to enjoy his wondergoals and killer form, but to take that next step he has to finish all of his easy chances in addition to the occasional belter. Also, a few more pounds of muscle wouldn't hurt. but wow, is he on form at the moment when it comes to shooting from distance.

5.) 05 Jan 2018 22:52:18
And his work rate hasn't dropped one iota. Miki looks petrified.

6.) 05 Jan 2018 23:50:45
It's taken him until the age of 24 to look like a true quality player. Rashford is just 20. He may not have had a great couple of months but give him time and he'll be right up there too.

7.) 06 Jan 2018 02:21:42
Shaw would rash be happy to play jessie bit part role for 3 years until he is 24? Jessie has shown great patience and worked ever so hard.



28 Dec 2017 13:47:35
Mourinho is voicing exactly what United fans believe, which is that City are now way ahead of us in terms of everything we have come to expect and desire in football, and that all our spending and high wage bill, is not enough, so much of it having been misspent.

Let's face it though, it didn't happen in one year. It's the culmination of a strategy begun by City a decade ago. All this talk about noisy neighbours may have been clever for a while, but the writing has been on the wall since they poached Tevez. The fact is they have been on the up, prepared to do what it takes with a largely unlimited budget, and we've only had one direction to go.

People talk of SAF's masterstroke buying RVP, but as far as I'm concerned it was a piece of extreme short-termism. One injury ridden aging striker's great year and an absence of quality in the league that season might have brought us a championship, but it papered over a decade of neglect where "no value" was in the market. That deflection may have come from SAF or it may have been imposed upon him by a club saddled with enormous debt servicing requirements, but either way the result is plain for all to see. In terms of what we care about - not revenues, not crowds etc but football - we are now #2 in Manchester. No amount of braggadocio can change the fact that City seem to be playing on a different planet, threatening to re-create a Barcelona like dynasty in England.

The big question is whether Mourinho, given what he inherited, his abilities and style, and operating in this market within our club structure, can take the next step from what has been a clear EPL improvement, to becoming realistic challengers for the European Cup. It will not be easy. Teams like City and PSG are clearly already ahead of us. They seem to have unlimited funds and can thus match us in future buying power. The Spanish clubs may always be more attractive for top South American talent than rainy old Manchester. Bayern and Juventus do not have the same quality of domestic competition.

My question then is this: if you're not happy about the state of affairs, which most of you clearly aren't, then why on earth should our extremely competitive manager be? Why would you expect him to smile about being #2 in Manchester, let alone England or Europe. For the time being Mourinho is merely reflecting the frustrations we all feel. Frustrations that are compounded by the sense that there may not be a manager we could actually hire that could do any better.


1.) 28 Dec 2017 14:06:01
Shaw, I agree with pretty much all your post apart form the final bit. Jose is unhappy, but he is one of the world’s best coaches so surely he has the ability to improve what we have. Our League position is better but too many players are not playing to their potential (as WRD points out further down), I’m also pretty frustrated about that.

2.) 28 Dec 2017 14:20:01
I have always said judge the man after 3 windows. i don't believe we will win CL after next summer but firmly believe we will have the nucleus off a great team that will need minor adjustments. We were in 6th/ 7th place last year this time and miles off. we have come a long way and the fact that we expect to win every game says a lot which was not the case 12 months ago.

We had 23 shots and 73% possession the other night. we dug ourselves a hole by conceding early. our defense is a makeshift outfit week in week out at the moment and we are conceding a lot more compared to first 10 games. I still think we will finish second and that is a big step in the right direction given where we have been last few years.

3.) 28 Dec 2017 14:44:34
I agree with you post but at the end of the day he’s the one in charge, he’s spent big money and he’s supposed to be one of the best managers ever? His complaining looks like a desperate attempt to blame others, it’s childlike and desperate. I think if he’s sacked by Manchester United he’ll struggle to find much more work, I think footballs outgrowing him slowly. From Mourinho a signing who is flourishing? Who looks good? Who would make it into another top aide? Your best players are ones who were there before him. Rashford, mata, De Gea. if he received no backing i'd understand his loaning but he has squandered fortunes.

4.) 28 Dec 2017 15:08:32
Very good post Shaw.

5.) 28 Dec 2017 15:17:31
As far as I'm concerned Pogba was a great signing. Our results when he's in the team are far better than when he's not. When he plays our attack always looks better, and our chances and goal scored stats will bear that out. His long range passing is fantastic. Had he not even playing against Burnley I'm convinced we would have lost. His one failing is that he doesn't score enough. Improve on that aspect - maybe some Coutinhoesque outside shooting - and it will become more obvious what a great player he is. Matic was also a great signing given what we had. Lukaku has been okay - jury's still out. Mhkitaryan and Lindelhof don't look very good but the latter may well grow into the position. Bailly was an excellent signing but has suffered from too many injuries. Ibrahimovic was a free and filled the bill for a season. Overall Mourinho has done a decent job with transfers, especially when taking into account who might have been available for us, the nature of the squad he inherited, and the debacle that preceded him under Moyes and LVG.

Despite all that we are still in 2nd place, which for most teams is as good as they can expect given their history over the last 25 years. So they may see that as success. But United fan are spoilt, and they can't deal with it. Of course the buck stops with Mourinho, but he like us will never be happy with not winning it all.

6.) 28 Dec 2017 15:49:40
Jose having this squad in 2nd place is hugely over achieving. Great job by the manager. This squad is not good enough for 2nd and no other manager could do better with these players in terms of position. A lot of the players are top 6 players that's where they have been finishing to be 2nd with this bunch is a massive over achievement.
Most of them have ever done better than where they are now in any league.

7.) 28 Dec 2017 16:02:33
Jose is a winner he knows what is needed and has come here for the challenge of getting us back to the top . # Bornwinner.

8.) 28 Dec 2017 17:34:57
Great posts Shaw, have to agree with all of what you said.

The only thing I'd say is that Jose, even if unhappy, should mask it better. When he is seen to be so unhappy and whingey, it becomes a knock on effect, the players will suffer. It's the same in any job, starts from the top down, workers usually reflect their manager. So on that front, even if unhappy, he needs to mask that better. Let your problems be known upstairs, let journalists who might be close to you put it in the paper. But don't go moping, whinging and deflecting when infront of the cameras or players. Be better.



27 Dec 2017 13:37:16
Considering Burnley have rarely conceded more than 1 goal in a game this season, and at most 3, which has happened twice, we should not dismiss lightly the fact that we came back from a deep hole and created enough chances to have won. At the heart of the come back was Pogba, who I thought had a very good game. His passing was excellent, as was his control: he generally looked like class. Without him I doubt very much we would have got a point and, if he'd buried that shot in the first half, and we'd ended up winning 3-2 everyone would be singing his praises.

The main problem with the team right now is in defense where Lukaku is a liability. The first goal came down to him yet again: he was completely out-muscled, and then headed the ball downwards, a fundamental error. That's not Pga's fault, and nor was the weak tackling that led to Burnley's excellently taken free kick.

So, I for one, think the criticisms of Pogba are completely misplaced. To me he looks every inch the player we paid so much money for. Given today's market I firmly believe we would get more for him than we paid. The team is way better with him than without him. The fact that we've created enough chances to have won the last 2 league games handily is entirely down to his influence while the poor results are down to others.


1.) 27 Dec 2017 13:43:15
I agree Shawthing.

2.) 27 Dec 2017 14:56:41
Thing is we didn’t sign lukaku for his ability to defend on corners. However, he is being given a job and should do better. There is enough height in the team to leave him up front for a counter however.

3.) 27 Dec 2017 17:01:41
Pogba is playing no where near his best he is a far better player than what he has shown at the moment .

4.) 27 Dec 2017 17:16:46
Pogba is totally under performing. For the money paid I expect a yaya Toure type performance from 2/ 3 years ago, I. e. driving from midfield and scoring vital goals. Bossing games and not just occasionally showing a burst of pace, a cross field pass or a misplaced free kick.

As far as Lukaku goes, I think he is doing ok with the terrible service he is receiving. I would rather have signed moratta as he has better technique and better movement. But I think Lukaku would be doing better if he had some service, if we could put in a cross or had a decent play maker who could put in a decent through ball.
At least local lad Lingard is performing. Always happy to see a youth team player doing well.

5.) 27 Dec 2017 18:54:16
The only part of Pogba's game that's missing is scoring the goals, otherwise he's doing just what he was purchased to do. Look at that ball to Rashford in the first half which ended up being cleared off the line. He completely bossed the game.

As for Lukaku I'm afraid he's just off the pace. There was a great cross in the first half which he failed to get to, and one in the second were he fluffed his header. Playing against a team like Burnley you're not going to get much, so you have to take advantage of the scraps you're given.



20 Dec 2017 22:08:33
I have to say I'm smiling a little at our defeat tonight. Having spent 5 years in my teens in Bristol, and been down to Ashton Gate on numerous occasions, the Robins are my second team. I can't say they were the better side but I can say that there were a few players whose performances were nowhere near what one would expect from a player in a top Premier League team. Both Martial and Rashford seemed to have no first touch at all, their dribbling was slow and ponderous. Promising situations evaporated one after the other at their feet. Good passing opportunities were missed. I'm sure the Beast will have something to say about it!


1.) 20 Dec 2017 22:11:17

Great performance from them, seem a good honest side and no reason why they can’t get promoted, good luck to them.

2.) 20 Dec 2017 22:17:23
Had a sneaky feeling we’d lose tonight. Zlatan (goal aside), Darmian, Rojo, Lindelof and Martial were awful.

Zlatan in particular looked very much like a 36 year old who’s been out for 8 months tonight.

At least we will get a reaction in the league now.

3.) 20 Dec 2017 22:39:01
Forgot to add Blind too. He was so bad I forgot he was playing!

4.) 20 Dec 2017 22:52:34
I'd add Rashford to that aswell. Infact the only praise idgive to anyone off our team would be Mctominay.

5.) 20 Dec 2017 22:57:12
To be fair how bad would it be to sell Darmian and Blind and bring back Fosu-Mensah and use Tuanzebe more.

6.) 21 Dec 2017 01:20:31
Dark Knight didn't mctominay lose his player and that led to their winning goal, he looks a bigger Cleverly to me does the 5 yard passes but nothing beyond that.

7.) 21 Dec 2017 02:11:23
All I have to say is that no part of me enjoyed that performance, nor getting beat by a team we should be hammering.

After 10 minutes I felt we were in trouble with Pogba showboating in dangerous areas. Same performance I see every week, this time we got beat, normally we win or draw playing like that. I wonder how we will play on the weekend, spoiler alert "EXACTLY THE SAME".

8.) 21 Dec 2017 05:49:34
Have to disagree on Martial. I though Rashford showed his immaturity by being super selfish where he could have squared a simple pass for Lukaku to score. I think the midfield was quite poor and the distance between our kids and defenders and attack lends itself to long balls. all night no one available to take the ball in the middle of the pitch.

Mctominay was also poor if you watched his positioning through out the game and how far he was from where the ball was when our defenders where looking for a midfielder. Second goal was also his fault IMO.

It felt like one of those nights where the many of the players were trying to improve their own stats and not playing as a team. So many poor touches, poor passes and generally very poor decision making. I know people who don't like the manager will jump at him but the players were truly poor and that is on them.

Ibra looks miles off and a hinderance on the pitch. When you are 6 foot 7 and can't win a header that tells you something. Darmian looked like a division 3 player against their left winger and god helps us if he is going to fill in for Valencia.

9.) 21 Dec 2017 06:44:22
No one in the side can come away with a lot of credit following a performance like that. Bristol City were great and deservedly won. It looked like we just expected to turn up and win comfortably without much effort.

A few players who played last night such as Darmain (worst fullback in the league), Rojo (we should be paying teams to take him) and Mkhitaryan will be lucky to be here past January. Shaw, Blind, Ibrahimovic and Romero will also probably before the start of next season and obviously signings will be made to replace some. However, bringing back Fosu-Mensah and Periera as well as promoting Tuanzebe would for me be the right way of replacing some of the above.

10.) 21 Dec 2017 17:30:01
I think the criticism of Blind and Darmian is a little over the top. If you're not rotating the team regularly, you can hardly expect players to come in once every couple of months and pull out a top performance.




shawthing's rumour replies


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03 Aug 2017 19:59:22




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23 Jul 2017 20:46:28
He's not worth a penny over £150m.




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20 Jun 2017 13:13:24
Wouldn't surprise me if RM themseves were behind the Ronaldo rumours with the intention of complicating the Morata deal and ultimately getting a better price.




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08 Jun 2017 20:24:00
Compared to when the Glazers bought the club the interest payments are quite small. At that time our revenue/ turnover was approximately 1/ 3rd of what it is now and debt was twice as much with some high rate of interest loans. £400m net debt is very manageable especially when compared to Forbes recent valuation of the club at almost £3bn. In other words the directors have every reason to be satisfied with the capital structure of the club as it is. Debt elimination will be less important than fulfilment of the overall business plan.




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06 Jun 2017 22:38:53
Sanchez is in his last contract year with Arsenal which puts the power firmly in the hands of the player. The club will want to avoid the risk of losing him for nothing at the end of next season. Will he accept the reported £300k a week to stay where he is and play Europa League football? Given, no doubt, there are other suitors, is there any chance he will want to play in Manchester? Does he like Mourinho? I can see him leaving the Gunners for maybe £400k per week wages but a transfer fee closer to £50m than £80m.





shawthing's banter replies


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18 Jan 2018 12:19:06
That's what happens when you miss out on Salah.




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17 Jan 2018 13:00:04
Well said. In LVG's final year we scored 49 goals all season, this season we're on a pace for 80.

Some of us have refused to take the bait and constantly criticize him. I for one think he's doing a good job unraveling the mess he inherited. Not only that, I like his surly ernest manner. It's entirely appropriate. When you hire a person who's used to winning, why would you expect him he be happy losing? The fans aren't, so why should he be? All too frequently the press, with its tireless and inane questions, deserves to be treated contempt. I've never been convinced by all this talk about him being unhappy at United, or at least no more unhappy than he would be elsewhere if he wasn't on top.

We are the most hated team. The press reflects that. I guarantee you, if we were doing a City we would get only begrudging praise of it.




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13 Jan 2018 20:32:49
Whether or not Sanchez would be a plus in pure football terms is worthy of debate but to spend time conjecturing on his financial value based on wild speculation as to transfer fee, wages, signing bonus, agents fees and the value of a player going the other way, seems to me to be a bit pointless. Leave the money to the clubs. Would he fit in or not?




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12 Jan 2018 01:47:43
RVP was a short term purchase who had one good season for us. I would rather we'd bought someone like Silva. The only reason it was a good transfer was because SAF managed to make it work but it left the team with a conflict between RVP and Rooney when Moyes took over, and a midfield populated by top stars like Cleverley.




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11 Jan 2018 23:06:30
It's obvious that we've fallen further behind City, but the good side is that we may have moved ahead of all the others. If that's the case then we should be able to attract decent enough players to move ahead. The way things are right now, though all other conditions being equal, City and Pep will be a more attractive proposition.